A general list of ways to make this game better

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A general list of ways to make this game better

Postby dragginfins » Fri Nov 06, 2015 4:27 pm

I am taking turns playing and writing, listing things as I go, so apologies for the random set of info, some problems are more dire than others. Let's face it, the game needs help. It seems clear that prelaunch QA was absent or disregarded. It feels like it is in beta, or even an alpha stage as far as the tone and story are concerned. I followed this game for long enough to want it to be better. It's just enough fun to keep playing, but it is incredibly irritating in many ways, that leaves me with a cheap shitis aftertaste. :mrgreen: Here's to improvement, PROST! :b3:

Here goes:

1.) The combat commentary has got to go.
It took me a while to even understand what it was saying. Now I can't fight without noticing it. I get a lot of backstabs. I know. I'm doing that intentionally. Just let me do my killing without the awkward voice modulator commentary already. It has no value.
The other sfx are fine and I'd like to hear them.
Put a volume slider or on/off switch in the options please. There's already a screenshake in place. And it is listed on the side. Three forms of feedback are clearly too many.

2.) Let us use mouse wheel scroll in the options menu.

3.) Eliminate the crafting timer entirely. I've collected the ingredients and laboriously (or by sheer luck) found the recipe. The work has already been done. Don't make me wait. Additionally, more basic crafting guides should be included, preferably earlier in the game. I was asked to make some items that require other crafting items that I haven't figured out yet. I'd rather not open up a forum page in case it spoils something. (Also, why do metal rings turn into metal nails? That's not right. You use round stock or thick wire to form a nail by hand. Rings make chainmail and, if you don't have that much time - cheap bracelets.)

4.) Healing of pets and companions? I suppose there might be a skill somewhere out there but I think we could use this ability right off the bat. You don't get much help that I've experienced in ~10 hours of play time, so losing your wolf to a randomly tough treasure chest is a huge disappointment - and in story mode a reload. Let me give him a little schnapps now and then.

5.) Follower AI. Not so good. How about some basic commands? Attack, change follow distance, run away run away!!!, etc.

6.) So many teleporters in levels. Too many teleporters in levels. This isn't Star Trek. Now and then it is OK, and sort of useful to get around, but they. are. everywhere. Occasionaly they block one tile hallways too, requiring a round trip just to proceed.

7.) The shovel. So much wrong here. :34: First, shovels don't break that fast. I've broken many hand tools irl. Shovels are pretty resilient. Additionally, with all my DFS broken shovels, about 20, I have yet to unearth anything. Just a trail of broken shovels. Makes me not want to use them at all. If we want to go the digging route, then we are already investing time, don't make us pay an additional price. Right now it is punitive and pointless. At least just make it pointless. Please.
Screenshot attached with my most recent shovel breaking experience:
Dfs-2015_11_06__15.45.32.png

Futhermore, do our weapons break? How many times can I hit skeletons, break open rocks, and clear cut entire forests - with a ladle (might as well be a herring)? Infinite. What's with the shovel?! It doesn't match the rest of the experience.

8.) Eliminate the blue popup windows entirely. Use color coding in the side. Also, use color coding for my attacks vs followers vs enemies. Consider Color coding the damage to show criticals and backstabs, eliminating the need for the obnoxious voice. Also elemental damages could be displayed, so I have some idea of what gear/skills to use!!!

9.) Tone the weather down. The bloomy foggy thing obscures the map. Dial it back. Also, the day/night cycle should be turned off while underground. I let it go with the icy cave as I thought maybe the ice was a little thin, but when night came to the coal mine it was a little disenfranchising. Rain spots on the camera? That's confusing Forrest Gump rain! :07:

10.) Trap sense or something? I just randomly walk over bombs and spikes all the time. OK. Why? Most rpgs let you put some skills in perception or something along those lines. Or a sneak skill. Just something other than - HEY! SPIKES AGAIN!

11.) Mouse click destruction and early game fines. How about disabling mouse click auto attack for anything that is more than say, two tiles away? I've read most the steam reviews and the other two reviews out there and this is something that comes up frequently with the "tried for 15 minutes, got a refund" crowd. If you want to catch fish, buyers, and reviewers, you have to keep your hook attached! (please fix that too).

11.a) Mouse click NPC interaction + environmental degradation. They move and you have to keep clicking to speak to them, invariably destroying furniture/forests while doing so. Awkward!!! :33: Keyboard and enter can get you into the same bind. Sorry about the oak out front, I just wanted to see how your day was going. Welp, see ya later!
Other games use ctrl+click to target friendlies and the environment. Give that a try. Now.

12.) Rewrite the story. Make it grab you. Make it interesting. Avoid the amnesiac hero cliche!!! I'm ten hours in and can't really tell what the point is. I assume it is building up to something... about bad guys and stuff. There are writers looking for work out there. While I'm doing my random bounty hunting, there could be plot thickening. Something to fit the art style? But it isn't. And I'm beginning to care less about where this is going...

13.) How about a bounty board? Am I the only bounty hunter out here? Why just one quest spoon fed me at a time? The soil quests and crafting quests are just... filler. And the crafting quests are hardly worth the effort. I can make 10 grand on items from a soil quest. Then he pays me like 437. Thanks for the change.

14.) More of a bug report, but I lost all my enhanced weapon stats after I loaded the game!?!! And the enhancing screen is counter-intuitive, forcing you to remove your gear and drag it onto a giant gem is awkward. One more screen worth not having.

15.) Bad menus. Pushing "i" should take me to a useful screen, not a directory. We expect one key press to get somewhere useful. I just picked up a new shotgun and I want to equip it ASAP. On the PC, and the ports with larger screens, the inventory, equipment, and pets menus should be merged. Make use of that screen real estate. Have the menu on the top or on the side, but don't make it a separate instance, a "click gate" if you will. As water finds the shortest route downhill, good UI design involves the least number of clicks to enter and exit the desired menu. And that number should be one. There are a thousand ways to go about inventory management; according to this thousand-year-old knight, you chose... poorly. :b1: :12: :35:

16.) Status effect defense? The ghosts always put me to sleep. Dull. So far my items give a handful of offensive and defensive bonuses. I expect rings and things to give a little more than that. Poison resistance? Stun resistance? Lower duration of status effects? This feels poorly implemented when compared to other roguelikes/rpgs/tactical tbs. I read that some of these have hidden values. That's not a good idea. Look at your audience and then take a solid look at the competition. I'm not a min/maxer but I like to know what my odds are. Forewarned is forearmed. Knowing is half the battle. Blah blah blah. Eliminate redundant inventory menus and add a more detailed stats breakdown.

17.) Right click context menu is inefficient and awkward. Remove it. Awkward in how it rearranges based on location and edibility. Inefficient in that it involves more clicks than necessary. Crafting is a chore with this. The three or four different options do not merit equal display. We are mostly equipping gear and moving ingredients or selling things. Right click can do all of those things. The few times we want to eat straight out of the inventory, we can probably push an extra button, hold down shfit, ctrl, double click, or drag and drop onto the portrait. Then have a trash can in the corner for the very few times you want to throw stuff away. There. Problem solved.

18.) The crystals in the levels. What do they do? Explain this at some point in the game. Or, better yet, avoid a wall of text and make it obvious with game play...

19.) Repetitive/copy-paste levels. When going down staircases I get an exact copy of the above level. This made sense in one industrial level. Not as much in a cave. I find crates and chests in the same places too. Dull. Feels like a bug. Stretch that procedural muscle a little more often please.

20.) Minimap colors are too similar. The little spiky balls you can kick around are almost the same color as loot. When you don't have the two to compare on the minimap it is confusing enough to be a nuisance. I like to find loot much more than those toe stubbers. Change the colors.

21.) Skill descriptions are not enough. Numbers please.

22). Put your gun down, soldier. How about right click lowers the gun? I don't want to reach for escape. I definitely don't want to reach for that little X. I need to see if I can hit the target. This is pretty common with shooting. It is nice that left click moves the aiming direction. So... right click puts the gun away? :26:

23.) The omnipresent omnipotent Bureau of Public Beautification fines you for breaking a fence that you, I assume, put up around your own house. Maybe I'm renting? Annoying. I get it, don't destroy the stuff in town unless you think it's worth it. But it comes across poorly. More of that bad taste in the mouth thing... which takes me to my last point for the day:

23.) Tone.

Choose one and stick with it. This is how, as a whole, Lucas (nearly?) ruined Star Wars. Just watch the last part of TPM and tell me what the tone is. At the same time a great jedi dies this dumb kid accidentally saves the day. All the while this aquatic rabbit buffoon flips around a battlefield while some princess is having a shootout in her palace. It's lousy.

This game is also all over the place.

The art style says one thing. Then the cartoony characters say another. It's a little gut wrenching to read them both for their banality and their "adult" attempts. I just can't take it seriously. It's a ten year old that wants to be an adult. It learned how to cuss (more or less), drink (occasionally) and smoke when no one's looking. It would be having more fun if it would just play on the playground with the other kids. The cartoon/fairy tale look doesn't jive with the off-hand discussions of mass murder and... the weather. Actually, I take that back. The banality in the dialogs is spot on. Very adult. Kids are generally more interesting/less interested in small talk.

:idea: Cognitive dissonance is what I'm talking about here. :idea: It's driving people away from your game (if the obtuse interface doesn't in the first place). And it happens on several fronts. Most importantly, it lacks mature game mechanics (i.e. NUMBERS! worthwhile leveling system/skills system [refer to ToME, Divinity Original Sin, dozens of others]) but tries to act mature through occasional bits of dialog. The game play is not equal to the desire to be taken seriously. And so much of it is just a skin. The booze could just as well be potions. So it's red riding hood with a shotgun. I get it. Now don't make the characters look like cartoons and don't give me as many ladles to fight with and it might not be as much of an all-out assault on my conscious and subconscious or conscience. Oi.

Though the game is released, it clearly didn't get adequate testing. I would call it a mostly successful combat demo with placeholder features such as crafting and a WIP story. From what I've seen of the story there isn't a whole lot to it. So I imagine it could be rewritten at this point.

It's great how responsive the devs have been so far. So do us a big favor and make some changes. Minor and major.

Prost! :b3: :b2: :b1:
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A general list of ways to make this game better

Postby ROBOT » Fri Nov 06, 2015 4:27 pm

Oh, hey dragginfins !

A general list of ways to make this game better? Humm, interesting!
Well well, let's see what others have to say on that matter :geek:
I personally think that A general list of ways to make this game better...
Nah, i dunno... never mind...

I 'm just here to raise the post count. What do i know, right?
Cheers!
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Re: A general list of ways to make this game better

Postby Randis » Fri Nov 06, 2015 6:13 pm

Thank you for all the detailed feedback! :44:
A lot of that is already on our to do list and will be addressed in patched!
we are working hard on it!

4.) Healing of pets and companions?
there are a couple healing spells just to heal companions but when your pets die
you can do > spoiler: take them to a red or blue altar and offer the KO pet as an offering to get it revived for free or take em to the Vet in the town, the dude with the cleaver next to a small med tent.
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Re: A general list of ways to make this game better

Postby BigMonD » Fri Nov 06, 2015 8:13 pm

woah thats a lot.

2) Oh god yes, need this so badly.

3) I do think you should have some basic recipies from the start. She lives alone and cant make a single thing. Maybe some items that dont give much but add flavour to the game. EG spicy curry that makes you hichup for a short while.

4) I cant work out the pets own healing mechanic. Sometimes he seems to tank everything. Sometimes hes low really easily. I think really we need a smaller version of our own health bars in the corner for pets.

7) ok a herring needs to be a usable weapon.

10) I should be able to manually check a space. For example using an xbox controller Pressing A picks up an item on the square in front of you so you can pickup from traps. There should also be a button to search the square in front of you to reveal SOME traps.

18) I was wondering this too. I still cant work out what they do.
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Re: A general list of ways to make this game better

Postby Randis » Sat Nov 07, 2015 7:28 am

we will make crafting recipes persistant across game modes and when you start a new game.
there is a fish that can be crafted into a weapon btw.
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Re: A general list of ways to make this game better

Postby Randis » Sat Nov 07, 2015 7:28 am

we will make crafting recipes persistant across game modes and when you start a new game.
there is a fish that can be crafted into a weapon btw.
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Re: A general list of ways to make this game better

Postby ArchGaden » Sat Nov 07, 2015 8:25 am

#3 Next patch is going to shorten craft timers, so we're in luck there

#7 Shovels not finding stuff seems to be a PC version bug that will be fixed in the next patch as well
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Re: A general list of ways to make this game better

Postby Randis » Sat Nov 07, 2015 8:27 am

the shovels worked in the previous revision but a bug fix for another issue disabled the shovels function... QA missed that one... Sometimes a simple change in code fixes one thing and can create a side effect somewhere else that is why some fixes take longer as everything needs to be tested again :(
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Re: A general list of ways to make this game better

Postby Yarott » Sun Nov 08, 2015 2:18 am

You know, from my experience, having the context menu work outside would be good for things like Pet AI commands, or inspecting the square ahead of you, would be a helpful thing. But, the context menu is rather dedundant on the different root menu screens, given that the same amount of commands can be assigned to a controller's face or shoulder buttons. X for the Green Arrow icon, the Triangle itself can just be assigned to dropping the item. And the eating action could just be assigned to one of the shoulder buttons. In fact, there are far less buttons in use. And not even in a good way, when you think about it.
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Re: A general list of ways to make this game better

Postby Randis » Sun Nov 08, 2015 3:12 am

we are making re-designs to the UI functionality, things will be a lot more simple and user-friendly!
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